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Old Aug 15, 17, 6:18 am #1
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Air Berlin Files for Bankruptcy

Story Developing.....

https://bloomberg.com/news/artic...cy-proceedings
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Old Aug 15, 17, 6:23 am #2

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Apperently the german goverment is offering emergency loans - flights are supposed to continue for now (http://spiegel.de/ German only

Will be interesting to see what happens to TopBonus since ist owned by Ethiad...
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Old Aug 15, 17, 6:33 am #3

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It seems that the procedure applied for, is permitting AB to continue to operate and find a solution in a defined period of time. Usually, the court would appoint an external insovency expert to supervise this process, but AB applies to do it themselves.

I'm not a specialist in german insolvency law, but AFAIK this procedure is requiring certain preconditions to be met. A court will decide.

Interestingly, they filed insolvency in Germany, although they are a UK registered firm ...???
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Old Aug 15, 17, 6:33 am #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frogster View Post
Apperently the german goverment is offering emergency loans - flights are supposed to continue for now (http://spiegel.de/ German only

Will be interesting to see what happens to TopBonus since ist owned by Ethiad...
Appears Lufthansa and government will step in for now.....
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Old Aug 15, 17, 6:37 am #5

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I'm sure the Italian government will be watching closely for the support the German government gets away with giving in the context of EU rules
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Old Aug 15, 17, 6:39 am #6
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Originally Posted by ajeleonard View Post
I'm sure the Italian government will be watching closely for the support the German government gets away with giving in the context of EU rules
This sounds rather negative on Bloomberg....

Quote:
Air Berlin Plc filed for insolvency proceedings after main shareholder Etihad Airways PJSC withdrew its financial support.

The discount carrier and subsidiaries submitted the filing in a local Berlin court, though it wont seek bankruptcy protection for its Niki Luftfahrt GmbH and Leisure Cargo GmbH units, Air Berlin said in a statement. Talks with Deutsche Lufthansa AG and other parties regarding disposals are continuing, it said.

Air Berlin has been restructuring in an effort to stem years of losses, including leasing part of its fleet to Lufthansa. Plans to merge Niki with TUI AGs German airline arm fell apart in June after Abu Dhabi-based Etihad said it failed to reach a deal on forming a joint venture for the operation.
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Old Aug 15, 17, 7:16 am #7

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajeleonard View Post
I'm sure the Italian government will be watching closely for the support the German government gets away with giving in the context of EU rules
Quite interesting to see, especially if one considers that Italy gave AZ emergency loans of about 300 mio € in order to ensure that AZ stays flying while the bidding for AZ, or parts of it, is proceeding.

German news magazine DER SPIEGEL just reported that the German government gave a loan of 150 mio € to AB in order to avoid an immediate stop of all operations which would have been required otherwise (don't forget that we are in the middle of holiday season and no one is interested in lots of stranded families). This money can help AB to fly for about another 3 months. Additionally, the German government expressed hope that LH is able to take over some parts of AB.

Lets wait and see what happens.
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Old Aug 15, 17, 7:30 am #8

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scrooge McDuck View Post
Quite interesting to see, especially if one considers that Italy gave AZ emergency loans of about 300 mio € in order to ensure that AZ stays flying while the bidding for AZ, or parts of it, is proceeding.

German news magazine DER SPIEGEL just reported that the German government gave a loan of 150 mio € to AB in order to avoid an immediate stop of all operations which would have been required otherwise (don't forget that we are in the middle of holiday season and no one is interested in lots of stranded families). This money can help AB to fly for about another 3 months. Additionally, the German government expressed hope that LH is able to take over some parts of AB.

Lets wait and see what happens.
Especially this close before an election...
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Old Aug 15, 17, 7:38 am #9

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Why doesn IAG or Qatar buy them to keep them in the OW fold?
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Old Aug 15, 17, 7:41 am #10

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Originally Posted by NathanM View Post
Why doesn IAG or Qatar buy them to keep them in the OW fold?
Because they don't want to throw good money after bad.....
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Old Aug 15, 17, 7:41 am #11

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Originally Posted by NathanM View Post
Why doesn IAG or Qatar buy them to keep them in the OW fold?
Perhaps because they're not as fond of burning money as Etihad were?
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Old Aug 15, 17, 7:42 am #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NathanM View Post
Why doesn IAG or Qatar buy them to keep them in the OW fold?
Because the carrier is not financially viable and oneworld doesn't really need AB. Sure, it makes a few connections and routes within Europe a little easier on the alliance but overall it is an overlap, not a unique set of routes or airports.

Also, buying an airline that lost more than a billion dollars the past couple years doesn't sound like a particularly smart investment. It'll be sold off for pieces.
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Old Aug 15, 17, 7:48 am #13

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Quote:
Originally Posted by swiss_global View Post
It seems that the procedure applied for, is permitting AB to continue to operate and find a solution in a defined period of time. Usually, the court would appoint an external insovency expert to supervise this process, but AB applies to do it themselves.

I'm not a specialist in german insolvency law, but AFAIK this procedure is requiring certain preconditions to be met. A court will decide.

Interestingly, they filed insolvency in Germany, although they are a UK registered firm ...???
Air Berlin PLC & Co. KG is a German registered entity which is like a partnership between the UK PLC and other German participants. The PLC part takes the liability within the partnership.
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Old Aug 15, 17, 7:50 am #14
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I agree with the investors being unwilling to go after a money hole. I disagree though that it adds little to the alliance. Perhaps just for my locations (CPH-TXL-WAW, all three *A hubs) removing AB essentially means I no longer fly OW. Perhaps I need it once a year for an odd long haul. And we loose OW connections to many small German airports.

Finally, the amount of BA posters here about earning and burning indicates that BA does not cover a visible part of the market.
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Old Aug 15, 17, 7:51 am #15
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Originally Posted by NathanM View Post
Why doesn IAG or Qatar buy them to keep them in the OW fold?
Does BA or QR even work with airberlin? Are there are even any codeshares on each others' flights?

AB may be in oneworld, but that doesn't appear to mean much to BA or QR. AB is not part of the oneworld transatlantic joint venture, for example.

I honestly don't think BA or QR would even notice if AB disappeared.
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