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Old Nov 5, 17, 8:13 pm - Wikipost
Cpi-Web Forums Thread Wiki: Applying for Chase Credit Cards, 2017 onward
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This thread--a continuation of previous discussions through May 2015 and December 2016--focuses on general Chase policies & practices for new applications. For information on specific Chase cards and their bonuses/terms/benefits, see the following threads and their associated wikis:
Table of Contents
  1. Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?

  2. What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?

  3. Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?

  4. How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?

  5. How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?

  6. Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?

  7. Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?

  8. Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?

  9. I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?

  10. I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?

  11. I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?

  12. How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?

  13. Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?

  14. Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?

  15. Useful Chase telephone numbers

Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?
Chase does not have a known limit. However, several reports (for example) indicate that Chase is highly sensitive to multiple applications within a short time period, and that the second (or subsequent) applications run a substantial risk of being denied. In many cases, this is likely related to Chase's practice of allocating a large credit line (up to an applicant's personal maximum) when approving a new card such as the first application in a series. (See also the discussion below concerning aggregate Chase credit lines.)

What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?
Starting in May 2015, Chase began denying applications for its own personal cards (e.g., Sapphire Preferred, Freedom, Slate & Freedom Unlimited) if the applicant's credit report shows that she or he opened 5 or more credit cards with any card issuer in the prior 24 months ("the 5/24 rule").

For a few days in early September 2016, Chase included explicit language ("You will not be approved for this card if you have opened 5 or more bank cards in the past 24 months") on the application page for the Sapphire Reserve card--and then promptly removed it. The absence of this language on landing/application pages for the CSR or any other Chase card is not a reliable indicator of whether the 5/24 policy applies.

See the next section for co-branded cards exempt from the 5/24 policy, and the later section discussing potential ways around 5/24.

Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?
Previously the rule did not apply to applications for the Ink Plus business card or to co-branded cards such as United, Hyatt, IHG, etc. However, on May 22, 2016 Chase extended its 5/24 rule to cover Ink business cards and some co-branded cards. (Note that there were premature reports that Chase Ink Plus would be made subject to the rule in March 2016 (which did not happen), and that all co-branded cards would follow in April 2016 (also did not happen).)

Although we had numerous reports of applications prior to May 22 being denied for a United/Hyatt/IHG/WN card by a CSR citing the 5/24 rule, the available evidence strongly suggested that those applicants had other serious issues--multiple Chase applications in a short period; large existing Chase credit line--and that overzealous CSRs gratuitously (and erroneously) invoked the 5/24 rule in the past as an additional supposed justification for the denial. Thus, it is difficult to separate such false positives from any change in Chase policy.

Instead, the most useful data points are those where an applicant is approved for a Chase card despite being over 5/24. Since May 22, 2016, we have such reports for these co-branded cards (in order from oldest to newest for each card):
For a longer list of cards apparently not subject to 5/24, check this link:
http://doctorofcredit.com/chase-...ail-need-know/
Please follow discussion in the thread for current updates.

How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?
The 24-month count includes personal cards opened at other banks, and even cards on which the applicant is only an authorized user and not the primary cardholder. Chase has been extremely inflexible with this policy, with agents stating that there is nothing they can do to circumvent this restriction. However, in some cases Chase may reconsider a denial if the applicant has <5 new cards excluding cards on which s/he is an authorized user. You may need to escalate to the next level of customer service agent, as many front-line agents seem to be unable or unwilling to remove the authorized user accounts from the count.

Note:

How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?
In February 2017, a FTer reported a successful application a day or two after dropping from 5/24 to 4/24. However, because Chase sometimes approves applicants who are at 5/24 exactly (see above), this data point does not conclusively prove that Chase drops cards from its calculation on the exact 24-month anniversary of the previous bonus.

Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?
No. Chase uses the information from your credit report, and closing an account doesn't make it disappear.

Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?
As to targeted mailers, we have insufficient anecdotal evidence to reach any reliable conclusions. (Reports suggesting no exemption from 5/24 here and here.)

There have been reports of people with more than 5 cards opened in the last 24 months being successful if they are already pre-approved for the card in question. To find out if you are pre-approved, you can call or go into a branch to ask. Success stories appear to be connected to Chase Private Client (CPC) status and the rollout of the Chase Sapphire Reserve card. In-branch pre-approvals (showing a green screen on the banker's computer) result in automatic approvals. Some (but not all) CPC clients had success in recon calls[citation needed].

Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?
It depends. A Chase card may be "churned" when an entirely new version becomes available. For example, business cards are distinct from personal/consumer cards. Note that simple variations among bonus offers do not amount to new versions/products for purposes of this rule.

Beginning in 2014, Chase began including explicit language in most of its offers, such as the following from a standard Sapphire Preferred offer:
Quote:
This new cardmember bonus offer is not available to either (i) current cardmembers of this consumer credit card, or (ii) previous cardmembers of this consumer credit card who received a new cardmember bonus for this consumer credit card within the last 24 months.
There are four key considerations in determining whether you can churn a given card:
  • The 5/24 policy discussed in detail above.
  • The 24-month bonus waiting period is measured not from the date of your previous application (or approval date, if different), but instead from the date you received the signup-related bonus on the previous card, which may be 3-4 months later than the approval date. The same rule applies regardless of the type of signup bonus received (points, miles, or free-night certs); anniversary benefits unrelated to spending requirements, such as annual IHG & Marriott certs, do not count as signup bonuses.
  • If you still have your old card of the same type, you're ineligible.
  • Chase's policy does not indicate whether there is also a minimum waiting period between cancellation and reapplication, and there is not yet sufficient anecdotal evidence from FTers to draw firm conclusions. At a minimum, a prudent churner will wait at least a week or two after cancellation before reapplying so that all of Chase's systems fully reflect that closure. (See first bullet point above.) At least one FTer has reported re-applying successfully 14 days after canceling the previous card.

Finally, note that if you reapply too soon, Chase may still issue you the new card. (This differs from some other card issuers, which may deny such applications outright.) In this case, Chase typically notifies you by letter within a month or two after approval that, as a previous cardholder, you will not receive the bonus a second time.

I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?
No. Being an additional user on someone else's account poses no bar to applying for that same card & bonus, except insofar as such cards may count toward the 5/24 rule (as discussed above).

I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?
Yes.

In the past, the conventional wisdom among FTers was that you were more likely to hurt your chances by closing an account or reducing CL unilaterally. However, substantial evidence from 2014 onward strongly indicates that Chase is increasingly likely to reject applications (or at least not auto-approve them) where an applicant has an existing total credit line that is high compared to his/her income & spending patterns. (For many members, the threshold appears to be in the $45K-60K range, but that is highly speculative.)

Recent reports suggest that closing accounts and/or voluntarily reducing credit lines increases the odds of auto-approval or in-branch pre-approval. (You can do either by calling or simply sending a secure message through your Chase online account. You do not need to provide a reason for the request.) For best results, keep at least $5K-10K in excess credit; if your application is not approved, you can always contact the reconsideration department and offer to reallocate that portion of your existing credit line. Note: despite allowing credit line to be moved between personal and business accounts in the past, Chase is no longer permitting such reallocation in either direction.

With respect to timing, it is better to reduce any CL as soon as you can conveniently do so, e.g., after meeting the bonus spend on a card you do not plan to use regularly thereafter. (Do not reduce CL on a given card if it would increase your "credit utiilization"--that is, the ratio of outstanding balance to CL--above ~30%. A high credit utilization number is a red flag for banks and can adversely affect your credit score.) Waiting until one's next application to lower a CL is less than optimal, as the reduced CL is not immediately recognized by all of Chase's systems.

There is no known minimum wait between lowering a CL and having the freed-up amount become available for purposes of a new application. A prudent applicant will, as recommended above, plan well in advance; failing that, an applicant would be wise to wait at least 24 hours between lowering a CL and applying for a new card.

I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?
It may be better to avoid calling Chase unless your application is denied. Many recent calls on pending applications led to denials, and many people report having success letting applications work their way through the system. Be patient. Time is on your side; increasingly, Chase CSRs are not.

If you do call, expect extensive and possibly hostile questioning. Be prepared to answer questions regarding the need for more credit, past credit apps for both Chase and other banks, income, business finances, etc. Know your CLs with Chase before you call so you know which card/s you are willing to decrease the CLs on. If the app is for a significant other who dislikes such calls, they can authorize you to speak on their behalf and hand the phone over to you.

How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?
Just send Chase a secure message (SM) through your online account. Although the deadline should in theory be N months from the date of approval (not the date of application or card activation)--where N is the number of months specified in the offer--Chase typically pads this period to account for the time required to fabricate and deliver physical cards. For example, a recent "3-month" deadline was in fact 114 days, as confirmed by Chase's SM confirmation.

Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?
Bonus points typically accrue at the close of the billing period in which you incur the corresponding charges. Points should appear in your hotel/airline account within a few days thereafter.

NOTE: If you complete your required spending in the last 7-10 days of the statement period, the bonus may not post until the following month's statement, even if the regular per-dollar points post on the first statement. This is normal behavior for Chase and is not worth a phone call.

Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?
See the discussion at

Useful Chase telephone numbers
(800) 432-3117 – General Application Status Line, automated
(800) 436-7927 – Alternative General Application Status Line, automated
(888) 609-7805 – Alternative Personal Reconsideration line with live rep
(800) 453-9719 – Business Credit Card Reconsideration Line with live rep
(800) 955-9900 – General Card Services and Application status, automated
(888) 298-5623 – Credit Reallocation Office (Personal cards)
(800) 453-9719 – Credit Reallocation Office (Business cards)
(888) 622-7547 – Executive Offices
(877) 470-9042 – Personal Application Verification line with live rep
Twitter:
Note: In the past, automated telephone status reports stating that Chase would notify you in 2 weeks often resulted in an approval, whereas the "7-10 days" telephone recording often indicated imminent denial. In 2016, this pattern became increasingly unpredictable, with many applicants receiving approval despite an earlier "7-10 days" automated telephone message. As a result, automated telephone responses should not be regarded as reliable indicators of an application's likely outcome.
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Old Jan 8, 17, 1:00 pm #46

Join Date: Apr 2014
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Quote:
Originally Posted by valuetactics View Post
I've reduced my CL to $5k on all Chase cards (via SM) one or two nights before I have applied for a new Chase card. I have done this several times and have got instant approvals each time.
Is there a consensus on if reducing existing CLs before applying is smart? Lots of recon reports saying people got approved after moving credit around, but if you preemptively reduce your credit, you obviously then won't have it to move around if you need to.
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Old Jan 8, 17, 1:00 pm #47

Join Date: Jan 2017
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Does the Chase sign-up bonus apply to the application date or the approval date?

I just applied to Chase Sapphire Reserve online and got a "We need to review your application a little longer" message. Called the automated application status line and it says that it might take up to 30 business days. If I get approved after the current promotion has ended, will I still get the 100k points bonus?
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Old Jan 8, 17, 1:38 pm #48
sfp

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CSR

Just applied for CSR. At 4/24 w/o AU cards.

Received 7-10 days message online. Called in a few minutes later, was asked to verify application info. Denied due to too many cards. Asked to have two AU cards removed, bringing me down to 4/24. Rep asked if I'd like to then have my application reconsidered, so I said yes. He came back and said that the decision was still pending and I would receive a response in writing within 1-2 weeks.

I called again a while later, and the rep asked, "Were you just talking to someone earlier about this application"? I'd never heard that before. She asked me similar questions and told me that my application was routed to a senior rep for final review, and I'd hear in writing within 1-2 weeks. She said there's nothing more I could do at this point.

Thought I'd offer the data point.
Thoughts? Would I need to be approved by the 11th to get the bonus? Or does it go by application date/the link I used to apply?
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Old Jan 8, 17, 1:38 pm #49

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ucdtim17 View Post
Is there a consensus on if reducing existing CLs before applying is smart?
FAQ #10 in the wiki.
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Old Jan 8, 17, 2:03 pm #50

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Quote:
Originally Posted by beltway View Post
FAQ #10 in the wiki.
Should have checked there - thanks!
ucdtim17 is offline Reply With Quote
Old Jan 8, 17, 2:15 pm #51

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ucdtim17 View Post
Is there a consensus on if reducing existing CLs before applying is smart? Lots of recon reports saying people got approved after moving credit around, but if you preemptively reduce your credit, you obviously then won't have it to move around if you need to.
This happened to me twice. However, I was approved both times after calling reconsideration. Its appears preemptively reducing credit lines did nothing to help the final outcome in my circumstances.
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Old Jan 8, 17, 2:26 pm #52

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Quote:
Originally Posted by aglasgow View Post
This happened to me twice. However, I was approved both times after calling reconsideration. Its appears preemptively reducing credit lines did nothing to help the final outcome in my circumstances.
I believe the general assumption in both cases is that what's holding back the approval is that you're maxed out on the amount of credit Chase is willing to give you. It's hard to know whether this is really the limiting factor for a given application (unless you get a rep who tells you directly). So really the only difference between reducing CL beforehand, and calling recon to suggest moving credit around, is that the first method may increase your chance of instant approval, whereas the other way requires a call to the recon line.
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Old Jan 8, 17, 4:27 pm #53

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Chase in-office "offers"

Depending on whether Chase counts AU and business cards, I currently have between 3/24 and 5/24.

When I was in a Chase bank yesterday, the Chase rep looked in their system and stated that I am "pre-approved" for 5 cards including Chase Sapphire Reserve (the one I want). He showed my the list and stated that if he clicked on one it would be mine.

I want to delay the in-office app by 2 weeks to get several large purchases in the 90 days. Also, my count of new accounts drop by 1 in the next 2 weeks.

Today I found where Chase offers can be found on their website. I did not see Chase Sapphire Reserve in my offers. Also, the site states that they will do a hard pull and make a final decision based on the findings.

I wonder if the list at the Chase office really shows "pre-approvals" or actually "prospective products" to sell the clients on.

Has anyone been rejected after a Chase bank "offer" is applied for in the bank?
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Old Jan 8, 17, 5:22 pm #54

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Quote:
Originally Posted by valuetactics View Post
So really the only difference between reducing CL beforehand, and calling recon to suggest moving credit around, is that the first method may increase your chance of instant approval, whereas the other way requires a call to the recon line.
This is like saying that the only difference between a hangnail and encephalitis is that they affect different body parts.

Experience over the past two years is that Chase phone CSRs were clearly instructed to start being gimlet-eyed credit Scrooges, and many of them obliged. Calling one is like developing a two-pack-a-day habit: it might not kill you, but the odds of a bad outcome appear to go up substantially. What you want is instant approval so you need not roll the dice with a Chase human.
beltway is offline Reply With Quote
Old Jan 9, 17, 11:41 am #55

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[QUOTE=austin.s;27726014]Does the Chase sign-up bonus apply to the application date or the approval date?

I just applied to Chase Sapphire Reserve online and got a "We need to review your application a little longer" message. Called the automated application status line and it says that it might take up to 30 business days. If I get approved after the current promotion has ended, will I still get the 100k points bonus?[/QUOTE]

Yes.
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Old Jan 9, 17, 11:58 am #56

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Applied for mariott business today and got "Further review". I called automated status line and got "You will be notified in writing about the decision made in 30 days". Does this mean its denied?
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Old Jan 9, 17, 1:06 pm #57

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If I decided to reduce a credit line on a chase card to give me some more room for instant approvals on subsequent applications how long after the reduction in credit line do I have to wait before it will be factored into my application? I know there is a delay with citibank from when you reduce a credit limit or close a card until when it actually frees up the credit for new apps.
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Old Jan 9, 17, 1:41 pm #58

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red259 View Post
If I decided to reduce a credit line on a chase card to give me some more room for instant approvals on subsequent applications how long after the reduction in credit line do I have to wait before it will be factored into my application?
Discussed in FAQ #10 in the wiki.
beltway is offline Reply With Quote
Old Jan 9, 17, 2:34 pm #59

Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 6
Angry Chase Sapphire Reserve card denied for "too many cards opened in last 2 years"

Well, I tried to obtain a Chase Sapphire Reserve card under the 100,000 point offer that expires January 11th, but was just refused because I have opened 5 credit card accounts in the last 24 months -- never mind that two of those accounts were for the same card (Delta Amex), one of which I closed 5 weeks after having opened it; both of which are now closed (paid as agreed, never late, and at my request); and I have an FICO score over 835, with a credit history that goes back a couple of decades and a credit report that lists no late or missed payments.

Could it be that Chase just doesn't want to award me 100,000 points?
UseorLoseGal is offline Reply With Quote
Old Jan 9, 17, 2:53 pm #60
mia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UseorLoseGal View Post
... refused because I have opened 5 credit card accounts in the last 24 months...
This is a well documented Chase policy, it's nothing personal. Chase has no way of knowing which cards you opened with American Express, nor do they care if the accounts are still open.

Did you open exactly five accounts in the last 24 months, or was it more?

When exactly was the oldest account opened? This information is used to calculate when it will scroll off the 24 month list.

Do you live in an area where Chase has retail branches? The Sapphire Reserve offer runs longer in branch than online.
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