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Old Nov 8, 17, 3:42 pm #1
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West Bank status in personal “countries visited” list

I maintain a list of “countries” I’ve visited. (I put countries in quotes because the actual criteria can be a bit inexact.) I visited the West Bank today and I’m now trying to decide whether to add an entry to my list.

I realize this question can be politically terribly complicated, and am not intending to create controversy. I’m asking more based on comparison with other cases, in combination with practical realities on the ground. Kinda fees like Area A at least is sufficiently distinct as a political entity to warrant including West Bank on my list?

Thoughts?
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Old Nov 8, 17, 4:01 pm #2

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It's recognized by some international bodies, right? I think that's good enough for your purpose. You probably won't trigger an international incident if you count it.
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Old Nov 8, 17, 8:16 pm #3
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Originally Posted by tai4de2 View Post
I maintain a list of “countries” I’ve visited. (I put countries in quotes because the actual criteria can be a bit inexact.) I visited the West Bank today and I’m now trying to decide whether to add an entry to my list.

I realize this question can be politically terribly complicated, and am not intending to create controversy. I’m asking more based on comparison with other cases, in combination with practical realities on the ground. Kinda fees like Area A at least is sufficiently distinct as a political entity to warrant including West Bank on my list?

Thoughts?
what would you do if you go to Cyprus and go to both Cyprus and The North that only turkey recognizes. If you go to Nothern Ireland do you check off Ireland or The UK. Go to Vatican City which maybe within Italy but is separate, does that get its own check off?

My list is of Countrys I went to, so The WB is Israel since Palestine isnt a Country nor the WB, go to Cyprus and the North there Ive only been to Cyprus, go to Belfast I went to The UK

then again some folks count a place even if they only transited thru it even w/o going thru immigration
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Old Yesterday, 4:26 am #4

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There's no official way of counting countries and territories visited, so you do whatever you please.

There's an organization called Travelers Century Club, where membership is restricted to people that have visited at least 100 countries and territories. Their definitions are very broad, and they currently have 325 countries and territories in their list. "Palestine" is included as a separat country, as is "Cyprus Turkish Federal State", and "Ireland, Northern." Egypt is listed as two separate entities, "Egypt in Africa" and "Egypt in Asia (Sinai)." Greece is listed in four separate entities, "Crete," "Dodecanese Islands," "Ionian Islands," and "Greece."
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Old Yesterday, 8:22 am #5
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My definition so far has been closer to the Travelers Century Club as described above. For example England and Scotland are two distinct entries in my list because they’re technically separate countries that happen to be in a union and effectively have no internal border.

I think I just answered my own question. Thanks for the input everyone!
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Old Yesterday, 8:32 am #6

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Originally Posted by tai4de2 View Post
I maintain a list of “countries” I’ve visited. (I put countries in quotes because the actual criteria can be a bit inexact.) I visited the West Bank today and I’m now trying to decide whether to add an entry to my list.

I realize this question can be politically terribly complicated, and am not intending to create controversy. I’m asking more based on comparison with other cases, in combination with practical realities on the ground. Kinda fees like Area A at least is sufficiently distinct as a political entity to warrant including West Bank on my list?

Thoughts?
I think we do these things only for our own satisfaction. Certainly there are no prizes offered to having lots of notches to your list of countries visited.

It seems silly to cheat oneself at a solo game, so I admit only sensible definitions of nations, and count as a visit only those that include a night's stay - outside the airport
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Old Yesterday, 1:26 pm #7

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Originally Posted by IAN-UK View Post
and count as a visit only those that include a night's stay - outside the airport
I understand your view (many others share that same view), but for me personally, I wouldn't be able to use such a restricted view.

An example: This summer, I visited Romania for the first time. I had a transfer with Tarom which involved a stay from approx 11:00 to 22:00. I took the bus into the center of Bucuresti, I was eating in restaurants, I visited a museum, and I went shopping. Should I then say that I have not visited Romania because I didn't stay overnight there?

Compare that to my first visit to England/UK, where I arrived at LGW at around 20:00, took a transfer bus to an airport hotel, got up early in the morning, and flew out of LGW again around 09:00. In that case, I actually stayed overnight, but I only saw an airport and a hotel. I saw much more of Romania on my first visit there, although it did not include an overnight stay.
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Old Yesterday, 11:57 pm #8

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Originally Posted by craz View Post
My list is of Countrys I went to, so The WB is Israel since Palestine isnt a Country nor the WB
Palestine isn't recognized as a country by most political entities, but even Israel doesn't consider the vast majority of the West Bank to be part of Israel.

The best descriptor IMO is that it's an occupied territory. From 1967 to 1988 it was occupied Jordanian territory. Post-1988 it's not really part of any country per se. You could call it occupied Palestinian territory, or I suppose you could call it occupied Judea and Sumeria.

Whether or not to include that in one's "country" count is a totally subject decision. But it's certainly distinct from Israel.
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Old Today, 1:15 am #9

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Originally Posted by themicah View Post
The best descriptor IMO is that it's an occupied territory. From 1967 to 1988 it was occupied Jordanian territory. Post-1988 it's not really part of any country per se. You could call it occupied Palestinian territory, or I suppose you could call it occupied Judea and Sumeria.
Without getting into the realm of OMNI, why the distinction between pre and post 1988?
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Old Today, 11:00 am #10
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Originally Posted by RedChili View Post
... This summer, I visited Romania for the first time. I had a transfer with Tarom which involved a stay from approx 11:00 to 22:00. I took the bus into the center of Bucuresti, I was eating in restaurants, I visited a museum, and I went shopping. Should I then say that I have not visited Romania because I didn't stay overnight there? ...
The traditional Chinese definition of being in a place is that you have to have eaten a meal there. By that definition, you were in Romania.

Personally, I go by whether or not I cleared immigration and customs. Got into a not-too-serious argument with a then girlfriend over that. I thought I had been to Australia because, on a mileage run, I walked around in the Perth airport car park for a couple of minutes, bought a T-shirt and some Tic-Tacs, and went back the other way for my return flight. I though I had, at least technically, been to Australia. She disagreed. (Any question about my having been to Australia has long since been put to rest by several more visits, most recently this past May, and all of them for much longer.) By that definition you were in Romania too.

None of which has anything to do with whether the West Bank is a country, of course. I think most of us would agree that Romania and Australia are.
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Old Today, 1:16 pm #11
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Originally Posted by themicah View Post
Palestine isn't recognized as a country by most political entities, but even Israel doesn't consider the vast majority of the West Bank to be part of Israel.

The best descriptor IMO is that it's an occupied territory. From 1967 to 1988 it was occupied Jordanian territory. Post-1988 it's not really part of any country per se. You could call it occupied Palestinian territory, or I suppose you could call it occupied Judea and Sumeria.

Whether or not to include that in one's "country" count is a totally subject decision. But it's certainly distinct from Israel.
I agree palestine isnt a country and never was.however for the most part Israeli law or policy is in place in the non PA parts of the so called West Bank, the parts under PA control is a very small %.

When I go up to The Golan Im not visiting Syria, even thou pre 6/67 it was Syria, its under Israeli law, so even if I thought it was being occupied by Israel its not, I would say had I crossed over from Syria that I was in Israel and check Israel off the list.

while landing in TLV and driving up and thru The Golan I wont cross Syria off my list, however in '73 I slept over night North of Kunetria which was given back to Syria, yet I havent cross

theres no 1 set of rules, only Id say a person should set up their own set of T&Cs to what is considered as having been somewhere. So does going to Hong Kong or Macau get China crossed off a list or does one need to enter Mainland China to do that, after all the visa didnt say Mainland China, some will say it knocks off both HKG and China while others will say it doesnt knock off China, since you dont get a Chinese or pass thru Chinese immigration
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